Ep 123. Why Knowing Better Isn’t Enough to Change

00:00:00: but what really ended up helping me was just coming to my own rescue and realizing, like I have to be in my own knight-in-training armor.

00:00:08: And I had to save myself when no one was coming... ...and it was up to me to really rescue myself!

00:00:13: Hi & welcome To Lead.

00:00:15: Well Another episode with a wonderful guest?

00:00:22: Hi Charissa

00:00:24: Hello thank you so much for having me today.

00:00:27: Oh, absolutely.

00:00:28: And I still look forward to this conversation because you are a pretty multi-faceted woman so your an award winning author and i know you also support authors with the podcast.

00:00:45: but not only that!

00:00:46: So you're nutritionist as well?

00:00:49: and a former psychology professor amongst everything else.

00:00:54: And then there is something about you that you have gone through chronic illness, and you've really lived what it means to live with such an autoimmune disease?

00:01:08: You managed to reclaim your health!

00:01:10: You look healthy at least for me which was wonderful And you were not chasing miracle cures, but you have combined science and self-responsibility.

00:01:22: And a deeply practical approach to self care which is yeah I love that because...I truly am a science person!

00:01:33: I believe in science.. I trust science....and i always feel if there's scientific research behind things then I can trust things just a bit more.

00:01:46: And you are also an author, of course as we heard.

00:01:49: so your book is called The Journey Back to Health and this book blends your personal story with some concrete tools.

00:01:57: and then You Are Also the Founder Of Five Tupress Supporting Women Who Want To Turn Ideas Into Meaningful Work.

00:02:06: As I said there are A LOT OF Things That You're Doing and that's So Great Because...I Feel I'm A Bit The Same.

00:02:13: There is this similarity that I've seen in when we started to talk through each other.

00:02:19: And yeah, what i would love to discuss with you is not probably all the different facets.

00:02:25: That will be too long for just a twenty-to thirty minutes conversation but Talk about healing.

00:02:34: so where Is this opportunity To heal ourselves?

00:02:41: do we need to heal?

00:02:43: Because I think it's not just healing the symptoms, sometimes you really have to change your life.

00:02:52: So what has that looked like for you and when was the first moment where you realized that it wasn't changing a habit or two but it was really changing?

00:03:09: Well, thank you so much for that introduction.

00:03:11: First of all That was so beautiful and I just want to say that even though it does seem like there's All these multiple facets of what i do It all really is interconnected Even my teaching career And my master's degree in psychology and nutrition.

00:03:26: So while I was in graduate school?

00:03:28: I actually studied nutrition In young children and nutrition in adults.

00:03:34: So even then becoming a nutritionist later in life Like he is connected to that degree in psychology.

00:03:40: And the reason I even started.

00:03:42: that answers your questions just a little bit as where this start was and when i was about eleven years old my mother got chronically ill to the point where she would be ill.

00:03:52: She's still ill, but we spent most of my childhood in a hospital setting and then just always taking care of her.

00:03:59: And not only that.

00:04:00: at about that age eleven years old I started taking care Of my siblings as well.

00:04:04: So i had two younger sisters At the time when mom literally went To bed from that point on chronic pain and chronic illnesses.

00:04:13: that were all interconnected, but the specialists we're taking care of her ended up getting pretty addicted to prescription medication.

00:04:22: To a point where I would really never see my mother again from this point on in life.

00:04:27: she was mostly in bed when she did come out of bed having drug withdrawals which created a monster in our home.

00:04:34: So it was something that I almost never wanted to see her because he was so terrifying when we would have those experiences of her coming down from these drug overdoses, like really truly overages.

00:04:44: and the reason i know is overages.

00:04:46: one time were at the hospital And the doctor came with medication.

00:04:49: He made a joke about if had just mixed this one or gave him more she'd die.

00:04:55: I did not laugh at that joke because i had made that mistake on a regular basis and what it turns out is That she was like pretty much immune to the drugs as she, was taking.

00:05:10: At that point And continued To go up up and up into opiates?

00:05:14: Things Like would just really make her like Not Really A whole person Anymore or not somebody who could take care of a family fast forward in my life.

00:05:22: i'm married i have two children and about twenty six Years old and i start to get chronically ill.

00:05:29: Ironically, this version of myself that I like promised i would never be... This thing that I would never ever do!

00:05:35: It was happening in real time and I was watching myself get more and more comfortable being in bed all day long while I had these two young children which scared me more than anything.

00:05:47: it's like you can't.

00:05:48: there's nothing scarier

00:05:49: yeah because I'm pretty sure that brought up all your childhood memories

00:05:53: everything!

00:05:54: Everything, all my greatest fears.

00:05:56: All my failures...everything.

00:05:58: So at that point I had already graduated with a master's degree in psychology.

00:06:02: i had already leaned into the research on nutrition..I was already learning about health.

00:06:07: because if you think about the pattern of being raised by a psychopathic drug addicted mother ...i went into psychology to fix my own brain and figure out why people snap ..and what drug addiction happens ,and why we can't take care of our health.

00:06:19: .all of that really points back to this childhood when I got sick myself, seeing myself in that sliding doors parallel universe of oh my gosh.

00:06:29: I'm the sick mom!

00:06:34: Not that I even needed another fire, not that i even need a reason.

00:06:39: I wasn't going to be the person!

00:06:41: I don't have ibuprofen in my house because of pain pill drug addiction.

00:06:47: there is no pain pill type medication at home.

00:06:52: so when they started telling me autoimmune disease Chronic illness, lifetime of pain.

00:07:00: Here's how we support you is through pain medication.

00:07:02: No one is looking at the root of it no ones going to the source Of It.

00:07:06: so I took my pain and suffering into My own hands.

00:07:10: i was very lucky At that time because i Was a professor?

00:07:13: I had this golden ticket to all the medical journals, because medical journals cost money.

00:07:19: If you want to go and read PubMed studies and see what the current research is... You might be paying sixty-two six hundred dollars To READ that research!

00:07:27: They have to get paid back for this study.

00:07:29: so they do.

00:07:30: Because I had that email address from a university, i had the golden ticket.

00:07:35: I could read anything I wanted to.

00:07:37: So I dug into the research and I healed myself!

00:07:39: I turned my own autoimmune disease within two years Into The person you see now...I make My bed at six o'clock in the morning And do not get back In my bed until ten o clock at night.

00:07:49: That's also A trigger for me Like..i don't Do spend time on my bed, i dont do Spend time On my couch....that would feel like i wasn't like, breaking this chain that I've been working to break since i was eleven years old.

00:08:01: So...that is really what my book is about!

00:08:03: My Book Is About- My Mom Was Sick?

00:08:06: I WAS NOT GOING TO BE THE SICK MOM.

00:08:09: THAT'S CHAPTER

00:08:09: ONE!!

00:08:10: I WAS not going be a burden for the family and put more responsibility on my daughters than they needed or deserved their children.

00:08:18: They should get to be children And..I kept that philosophy from them

00:08:22: and

00:08:23: healed myself as my own responsibility.

00:08:26: Now, it took two years.

00:08:28: It didn't take overnight like you mentioned in the introduction!

00:08:33: and getting it wrong, and trying to do way too much at one time.

00:08:43: And then feeling like I failed even though i was still getting better.

00:08:47: so Then I started reading books Like One of my favorite books is The Power Of Habit by Charles Duhigg and he talks about habits are formed one-at-a-time over twenty To sixty days.

00:08:58: So then I break it down.

00:08:59: Okay the kind of person that I want to be has these fifteen twenty habits?I have none of them.

00:09:04: It's going to take me fifteen-to twenty months To build those habits, be that person.

00:09:10: So then you really look back on my timeline and go okay it took two years.

00:09:15: That is reasonable!

00:09:16: Thats a reasonable thing for the request of human body to heal and recover over

00:09:21: time.

00:09:23: So what are those habits that your now following?

00:09:26: Oh,

00:09:26: that is so good!

00:09:28: Such a good question.

00:09:29: Okay?

00:09:29: So first right off the bat like I make my bed in the morning...I don't get back at my bed.

00:09:33: it's not even an option for me to go back to bed..so if i'm tired in the middle of day- I need to ask myself.

00:09:39: why am NOT getting enough calories and rest or sleep?

00:09:44: what is water or minerals?

00:09:46: Why is my body that should have perfectly, reasonably capable of sustaining a day's worth of energy not able to?

00:09:54: And that is where I get my habits from.

00:09:56: Okay so if it is that i am crashing in the middle of crash in the middle of day.

00:10:13: Start studying your physiology and understand why these things are happening, then you can build a habit off that!

00:10:20: I read every little bit everyday, internal everyday... Go

00:10:23: ahead!

00:10:24: And do make sounds so easy.

00:10:26: but what i come across is people know quite few thing nowadays about the nutrition, about the habits they should have.

00:10:35: But there are not a lot of people who really are then able to put those habits into practice.

00:10:41: so what's your secret with that?

00:10:44: I wish i had some kind of magic trick!

00:10:46: That was actually my graduate school thesis... Was why do we know what we should do and then don't do

00:10:53: it?!

00:10:53: And I wish that I could say its like willpower or whatever.

00:10:57: but The real truth is that We often are trying way too much.

00:11:04: And in order to even fit one new habit into your life, you first have to assess what am I even doing with my minutes and see where you're wasting time?

00:11:14: If you are wasting time if not...if your schedule is literally packed from the time that you wake up until then go to bed Then The First thing You Need To Do Is Just Have A Little Bit Of Grace Because YOU DON'T HAVE TIME TO BUILD A NEW HABIT Habits.

00:11:28: Take Time energy, mental energy.

00:11:31: And I often think of the research where they have a little mice or rat in a maze and put their cheese at the end to the maze watching for brain activity.

00:11:41: The first time that mouse or rat is in the maze every area of your brain is lit up like every single area is lit-up!

00:11:50: After you do this maze thirty to fifty sixty times all of sudden there's no activation habit built.

00:11:59: Now it takes no energy, so we have to recognize that as human beings when we decide I want to find that cheese!

00:12:07: It's going to take every single bit of brain power to get the first twenty-to-sixty days.

00:12:13: there has to be so much grace because make new habits and make changes.

00:12:23: And mostly what I see in people is that there really isn't space in their schedule to do it, There's no time.

00:12:29: so you're setting yourself up to feel like i failed?

00:12:31: I didn't do it right we can only doing one thing at a time One New Thing At A Time.

00:12:35: It takes twenty to sixty days and its gonna take all the mental brain power.

00:12:38: So if just know That If You Just Know That About Yourself Then You Say Okay First

00:12:42: I Have To

00:12:43: Like, maybe say no to some stuff.

00:12:46: Maybe there's something on Wednesday nights that sucks the life out of me and I have to cut it outta my schedule in order make space for the habits... ...that i want to have become a person than I wanna be And thats making hard choices!

00:12:59: And maybe thats where willpower comes.

00:13:01: but really its just consistency over time being ok with bored and planning like setting timer every day Holding yourself accountable.

00:13:12: It's not easy and it's almost all...it's the reason why that I really don't fault people for Not changing, i look at someone And just go oh you can't change?

00:13:20: Yeah That makes sense!

00:13:20: Its very hard.

00:13:22: You probably Don't have time..you Probably Have soccer practice seven days a week ..and you probably have to get dinner on The table ...And you probably Just don't have Time.

00:13:29: And then in that case Be Easy On Yourself Be

00:13:33: Easy ON YOURSELF.

00:13:34: Yes because YOU STILL DESERVE TO BE LOVED.

00:13:37: You still deserve To HAVE kind feelings towards yourself, irregardless of the patterns that you have.

00:13:43: Irregard this up to ability to exercise every day or eat healthy everyday like whatever those habits might be.

00:13:51: there needs just a lot grace and forgiveness And I'm doing enough.

00:13:56: The world is falling apart.

00:13:59: It's okay if i eat these cookies.

00:14:01: Yeah

00:14:01: nothing... There are lots in what your saying.

00:14:05: You probably know studies better than me but From what I remember is that the mental state you're in when doing things and eating, really also has an impact on how you digest them.

00:14:19: So if i eat cookies then I feel completely okay with that because it's good for me.

00:14:27: now even methodically they are different from when I ate a cookie.

00:14:37: Oh, absolutely.

00:14:38: And digestion and all of these things are absolutely affected by our hormones and feelings in the way that we feel about ourselves.

00:14:47: so if there could just be like... If anybody gets anything out this interview I gotta pick up a new habit.

00:14:55: Speak kindly to yourself.

00:14:57: It takes zero time.

00:14:58: It takes zero extra time in your day.

00:15:01: And if you could just say nice things, like wow I'm doing my best!

00:15:05: i did my very best at the end of the day instead of this oh-I didn't... Like you're saying about the cookies and how we digest things.

00:15:13: alternatively If you're driving down a road so stressed So amped up on adrenaline You are eating an acai ebol thinking ah This is the best thing im gonna get so healthy Im going to be the best?

00:15:24: No youre not Because your gut full of adrenaline and hormones that are causing you to be overweight, be unhappy.

00:15:33: Be uncomfortable.

00:15:34: it really is.

00:15:36: if we could just start by like speaking kindly and saying I'm so deserving of love and grace exactly where i'm at without changing even one new habit that I would love for people to get that.

00:15:48: And if i can add too, because sometimes it happens to me that I spill things and stuff like that.

00:15:53: so what do in those cases?

00:15:54: I always say Miss Chiginger!

00:15:56: That was perfectly done okay not as good

00:16:02: Yes, and that takes zero time.

00:16:05: And if you recognize or set it as a goal to make that as a habit You'll start to recognize.

00:16:10: all the times you say things that are not nice and not kind It's no one else in your head but yourself.

00:16:16: so really we have full control over That and you will digest and sleep and feel better If you're just a little nicer in your brain.

00:16:27: Yeah, I know Just a little bit more relaxed because that's the other thing.

00:16:30: always say, if I'm stressed.

00:16:32: If my body is stressed?

00:16:35: There's no energy left to digest.

00:16:42: Exactly!

00:16:45: Now i do have another question too because you described how your mother changed once she got this illness and I had a similar experience My father.

00:16:55: even before he was born He was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis so over his whole lifetime.

00:17:02: To me, he was just a sick father and I was told by my siblings who are much older than me, twenty years old other than me that He also turned into different personalities.

00:17:14: so this identity really changed.

00:17:17: Can you say more about dad?

00:17:18: And how have you personally experienced it?

00:17:22: Oh, I absolutely can agree that my in my experience.

00:17:27: I always wished i could say it was just the drugs That changed her but I do think she had a long history of mental illness and so It really perpetuated The chronic illness plus the mental illness like bipolar disorder depression things Like that And then constantly being in fight or flight.

00:17:46: If we find way to calm ourselves down We make decisions from better place speak differently, we act differently and I think what happened when she did end up becoming so ill is that everything just came from this place of haste.

00:18:04: This quick to react, quick to respond which destroys children like... Just instantly because children are just so pure and so innocent.

00:18:13: And when you have this like flip-flop, an unreliability it's So uncomfortable forever!

00:18:21: For myself When I got sick i immediately started to see she was acting from This quick place of being in pain?

00:18:30: And I could recognize that and feel That for Myself.

00:18:34: Maybe that Was part Of the point...I Could never be Like that.

00:18:39: I see my children as like the most...I'm very much obsessed with my children.

00:18:44: They're so beautiful and kind, wonderful in their hearts are so big!

00:18:48: And i am so obsessed with this alpha generation.

00:18:51: they just seem to be so empathetic and wonderful that we could never have a part in undoing it.

00:19:01: I am seeing, I'm in pain and i could have this reaction but it will crumble.

00:19:06: my children or I can see like.

00:19:13: have to even question myself like this, and I couldn't already because of the drug addiction issues.

00:19:20: Like i already couldn't take the drugs that they were recommending for the pain so i always had to find alternative routes.

00:19:26: things like really high-dose chamomile...like they make chamomil in a tincture that you have to dilute because it's so strong.

00:19:34: get it in australia?

00:19:35: And it would be like a very calming thing!

00:19:42: so bad for autoimmune disease.

00:19:44: It exacerbates every inflammation in your body from alcohol will be just like some of the chores, So I knew it wasn't going to that route either right?

00:19:53: So i did things like ashwagandha and really high strength kava.

00:19:59: Ashwagandha is a adaptogenic herb that helps with

00:20:03: the

00:20:04: whole endocrine system.

00:20:05: So like hormone regulation and things like, so I just really dove into herbs And specifically like calming herbs because autoimmune disease everything's on fire.

00:20:25: This is now a very personal question, but do you think that you were already in a high energy and stress state before getting your autoimmune disease?

00:20:40: Could this have been one of the reasons or...?

00:20:43: I think that's what caused the autoimmune.

00:20:47: becoming an adult at eleven years old, raising my siblings and then really pushing myself all the way through grad school.

00:20:55: By the time I had stopped grad school it had two children.

00:20:59: There was nothing left of my body to give.

00:21:02: I imagine it like, My organs were all these little raisins Like... It just dried up.

00:21:09: Yeah!

00:21:09: It made sense Adrenal Fatigue.

00:21:11: yeah!

00:21:11: It makes sense brain fog All this things.

00:21:14: Absolutely i think that constant state of survival from eleven to twenty seven That caused the illness.

00:21:24: Yes

00:21:25: Now when you're looking back now One question is, what does being healthy mean to you today that it didn't in the past?

00:21:38: And the other question really is... What could have helped prevent that whole story.

00:21:50: I think The way that i see health now Is so different than the way then.

00:21:57: because Now when looking at my body like this tool That will carry me As long as I want to be here.

00:22:04: And for a long time, i dealt with suicidal ideation because when you have a mother who's so bad it's So hard to wanna stay on the planet like your own mom tries To take you off of the planet Like its HARD TO HAVE THE THOUGHTS OF.

00:22:17: I WANNA STAY!

00:22:19: SO WHEN I FINALLY DID SWITCH INTO THAT MANTALITY OF OKAY I WANT TO BE HERE.

00:22:23: Health actually became this thing of my body.

00:22:27: is this, this vessel.

00:22:28: This tool that will carry me as long as I want it to.

00:22:33: so then It really switched My thinking like oh now its almost As if my body Is another one Of my children That i have To be obsessed with.

00:22:41: and did you eat enough?

00:22:42: Did You sleep Enough?

00:22:43: Did you get enough to drink?

00:22:44: no One ever cared about those things for Me!

00:22:46: I always was Like taking care of myself.

00:22:49: There were times where we are homeless No food no water no shelter.

00:22:52: there Were lots and lots of times where my needs were put so far aside.

00:22:57: And, So I just didn't care much about my body...and then when this switched to the thought that i want to be here..i'm going to thrive!

00:23:05: Im gonna do this life!

00:23:06: All of a sudden it started looking at me like wow this is a tool i have to take care of....so now everything's as if its was my

00:23:13: child!!

00:23:13: I am

00:23:14: obsessed!!!

00:23:16: What could've helped me?

00:23:18: Honestly I don't know that i could have been helped because i wasn't honest.I really never told anybody the truth about our living situation,because i was trying to protect my sisters like from...the threat in my house is if you tell anyone what's happening then CPS Child Protective Services will take and they'll separate you.

00:23:35: And there were other threats along with as well Like she would say once it takes them.

00:23:40: this is what happens to keep us locked in the prison.

00:23:45: And I just lied forever and ever, even until like therapy when i was going through finally coming out of it and go into therapy... Even then-I don't want talk about the past!

00:23:55: I need you heal me so that can get forward.. I can do this things But honestly if there were safe people in my life.

00:24:01: If someone who is really cared for me didn't say things like strong because they just didn't want to help.

00:24:09: If there were people, I think i could have gotten helped.

00:24:11: but what really ended up helping me was just coming in my own rescue and realizing like...I had to be my own knight-in-channing armor!

00:24:20: And I had to save myself and no one was coming and it was up to me to really rescue myself.

00:24:24: and..and....i really carry that now even.

00:24:27: Noone's gonna make me healthier stronger or eat or take care of me.

00:24:31: I have to do that and its ...my body is this tool if I wanna be

00:24:34: here.".

00:24:37: Doing it also to make sure that your children are cared for but you're not doing It for your children as I understand.

00:24:46: Yeah, I have to be for me.

00:24:47: I think because my Children off My children also serve us like a burden.

00:24:51: right these things?

00:24:52: I have two take care of and they're like a responsibility.

00:24:54: That doesn't really give Me Like the certainty feeling of all.

00:24:57: i want To stay here And learn and Be A person.

00:24:59: I do love my children obsess with them But thats Not.

00:25:02: They're not like The reason that I Want to be Alive.

00:25:05: I Love Them But I have other reasons, my own personal reason so that they are not... They're not responsible for my emotions and thats like another trigger from me.

00:25:14: And i tell them all the time youre'e not responsible making mommy happy.

00:25:16: You re not responsible if im sad ,youre not responsible If Im angry.

00:25:19: its not your job So it's also not their job to make me want be alive.

00:25:24: Yeah because there would a burden wouldn't it?

00:25:26: Absolutely

00:25:27: Wow!

00:25:29: You said people took away just this one thing and speak more nicely to themselves.

00:25:35: That would be great!

00:25:36: Is there anything else that you would want to share with others because you feel it's so important to understand?

00:25:44: I just want to reiterate, have grace with yourself but also if there is a version of YOU that you'd like to become truly here are the action steps.

00:25:54: write THAT LIST.

00:25:55: this IS WHO I WANT TO BE.

00:25:57: recognize that each one of those things is its own habit.

00:26:02: Give yourself twenty to sixty days per habit and do the math.

00:26:07: How long will it take?

00:26:08: To become that person, And when you really see three five six ten years then give grace and say okay I promise over The next ten years i Will be incorporating one of these habits at a time an in Ten years from now i will not Be where i'm standing right Now.

00:26:27: That's It!

00:26:27: Just Be Bold Be Brave Take One Step At A Time

00:26:32: And take your time.

00:26:33: Wow, that's really big!

00:26:36: Well thank you so much for sharing all of the wisdom and insight.

00:26:42: I knew this would be a very interesting conversation.

00:26:47: Thank You So Much.

00:26:49: And where can people find you and your podcast?

00:26:53: because you're also a podcaster, aren't you?

00:26:56: Yes.

00:26:56: The best place to find me for everything that I do-I'm a publisher, an author... I help women in publishing the best places is just my website so charissabradley.com.

00:27:07: You can find links from there including the Publishing House Five Two Press and Project Seed Money right on the homepage.

00:27:14: Wow, thank you.

00:27:16: and of course I will link everything in the show notes.

00:27:18: And i can only say a big THANK YOU!

00:27:21: Actually a huge thank-you to Rissa.

00:27:23: it was wonderful having her on this show.

00:27:25: Thank You It's been my pleasure.

00:27:26: thanks for having

00:27:40: me.